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graham 01 Profile
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Registered: 02-2004
Location: Middlesbrough UK
Posts: 5797
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The shooting re told


hi All

I know this has been threashed out before but it is a discusable topic so I have taken a past post and lets say for a better word reincarnated it here.

I wondered what the board memebers think of the suicide on board Titanic and who may of done it, I know the general concensus is William Murdoch, but may I start this conversation with a draft of a old post I made a long time ago which to me still stands. It may seem a bit jumbled but OI hope you get the gist of it and hope to have a flowing discussion on it afterwords.

Ok so was it William or not? First was there a shooting?if so by who and why?


May I make a few comments here regarding a shooting or lack of shootings.

First Murdoch may or may not be the officer
who shot himself, But this does lead to a leading question, Do we really know someone shot himself?

In all the arguments on this subject for some great big reason Murdoch always seems to be the one who they say has to of done. why. Sorry but I do not see any evidence as to a shooting let alone a suicide of a officer.

It is also correct that if a shooting did happen in reality it is not our or anyone's business but there own. Nothing can be done to change fact, but things can be done to stop innuendoes etc. I am not in a position to stop these as is no one else here. This is why when this subject comes up I tend to dodge it in the most, But this time I would like to hit a few things head on for the benefit of people here.

It is also a true element that there is various stories pointing towords a shooting and against it, There is a heavy cross section of beliefe on this topic.

WE probably will never know if a suicide took place. For a person to take his/her own life a number of factors have to be considered. One and most important one Why? Second there has to be assumed there is no other way out. In the case of Murdoch we have to ask why? The balance of the mind is often unbalanced and I see no reason to believe this to be the case here so again why? They may want to move on to a better place , I doubt in Murdochs case this is so somehow.

I will cover all the above shortly, It would be great to think he did not do it. I agree, we all think our idols, I don't use that patronising or anyway like that at all. would not do such a thing.

Ok so on to the questions, Why would he think he had to take his own life? Ok he may of preferred to die by own hand than that of God. Sailors where and are a funny breed. Superstitious to the hilt. The fact he would also know what was ahead. Cold water, thirst hunger etc. if the rescue ship did not get to them, He was also the ranking officer there, He was going to shoulder the wrath of a court. He knew the Captain would not survive. He was also in charge when the accident happened. Somewhere I read that he did not hand a sinking ship over to Smith, this is very true he handed over a damaged ship.

So no other way out maybe. There was the water and boats possibly. The water was ice cold and he more than anyone would know the cold kills a horrid death. Boats well he stopped on the ship till end where was the boats? Is he going to make one or die in the attempt.

Was his mind unbalanced? I doubt it but then again we don't really know, Peoples mind snap at certain things and often the smallest thing may be the catalyst for this. But he was a sailor well educated, long standing career. I doubt someone with a slight unbalance would of been there in his position.

finally wants to end it all. The most common of suicide thoughts. Again why. That one I cannot answer but doubt it.

Could it of been a cry for help gone wrong????

Ok on to the point of a cry for help.

It is often said that suicide is a cry for help. Sorry but that is the incorrect use of the words. Attempted suicide is a cry for help or threatening suicide. But to commit suicide most people who do it and regardless what we all think is not many, do it in private locations, Alone, and usually make there reasons well known by means of a letter or other form.

A short story for you to try to explain a little bit of what I mean.

A few years ago I was involved in a case where a woman had listened to her mother who had come out of a coma. She spoke of death freely and almost wanted it to happen. But in her coma she had spoke to her mother who had also told her of the exact time she would die and day. This lady did believe in such things at the time and was not so much upset but happy for her mother as she had always wanted to tell her mother things she had not done while she was alive.

The lady died at the exact time she said and on the day she mentioned.

Ok you ask what has this to do with suicide. well A year or so after this the young lady missed her mother and needed her so much she overdosed on tablets. It turned out later that she did not really want to commit suicide nor was it a cry for help as such, it was because she hoped liked her mother had done she would be able to talk to her mother as well again for one last time and tell her all the things she had not done. Ask for advice etc.

So now I am rambling. But my point is that I have not seen any evidence for Murdoch to shoot himself or any other officer for that matter.

Changing moods lets look at guns on board.

If someone comes towards you with a gun in there hand it would likely make you worry. This is the reason guns are carried on board ship, apart from the obvious of pirates. But it is to control panic ( I don't think I should of used that word but there we go) When the end of a ship is becoming close and people realise they are not going to get of there is generally a rush for boats or survival tools. A sailor may have to fire in the air, this will stop people from rushing forward and so stop panic. Daft in a way a panic related item cas stop the same thing happening.

Thanks for been so patient with me while I did this one and now I hand it over to you to discuss if you want to.

G



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Why dont people do what they say nowadays http://www.freewebs.com/hms-kellington/
http://www.freewebs.com/graham7760/index.htm
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Feb/10/2005, 12:50 pm Link to this post Send Email to graham 01   Send PM to graham 01 Blog
 
wills Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


no comment. emoticon

---
Suicide is a permenant solution to a temporay problem........

Whatever obstacles control,
Go on, true heart,
thou'lt reach the goal.


http://com4.runboard.com/bthetitanicshack
wills~~~~~
Feb/10/2005, 6:52 pm Link to this post Send Email to wills   Send PM to wills Blog
 
graham 01 Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


Aww wills

G

---
Why dont people do what they say nowadays http://www.freewebs.com/hms-kellington/
http://www.freewebs.com/graham7760/index.htm
http://www.freewebs.com/hmsroyaloak/
Feb/10/2005, 6:54 pm Link to this post Send Email to graham 01   Send PM to graham 01 Blog
 
wills Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


awww what? this is a subject that is very close to me.. closer then most can imagine.

at the present time i dont have much time to anser it properly but soon when i get my wits about me and a wee bit o' courage i'll gladly tell ya what i think of the entire thing.

besides i'm a bit curious as to what others think of this...

wills

---
Suicide is a permenant solution to a temporay problem........

Whatever obstacles control,
Go on, true heart,
thou'lt reach the goal.


http://com4.runboard.com/bthetitanicshack
wills~~~~~
Feb/10/2005, 7:19 pm Link to this post Send Email to wills   Send PM to wills Blog
 
graham 01 Profile
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Registered: 02-2004
Location: Middlesbrough UK
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Re: The shooting re told


HI Wills

Yes I knopw it is close to you and I respect your answer. I lok forword to it though

Graham

---
Why dont people do what they say nowadays http://www.freewebs.com/hms-kellington/
http://www.freewebs.com/graham7760/index.htm
http://www.freewebs.com/hmsroyaloak/
Feb/10/2005, 7:23 pm Link to this post Send Email to graham 01   Send PM to graham 01 Blog
 
wills Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


thank you ..


wills emoticon

---
Suicide is a permenant solution to a temporay problem........

Whatever obstacles control,
Go on, true heart,
thou'lt reach the goal.


http://com4.runboard.com/bthetitanicshack
wills~~~~~
Feb/10/2005, 7:24 pm Link to this post Send Email to wills   Send PM to wills Blog
 
graham 01 Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


No worries wills

---
Why dont people do what they say nowadays http://www.freewebs.com/hms-kellington/
http://www.freewebs.com/graham7760/index.htm
http://www.freewebs.com/hmsroyaloak/
Feb/10/2005, 7:40 pm Link to this post Send Email to graham 01   Send PM to graham 01 Blog
 
MurdochsAid Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


She can't answer, because she isn't and will never be Will's reincarnated self.

I believe Will did do the deed out of repentance, when he accidentally shot a 3rd Class/steerage passenger who tried to clammer onto a davit to get into the lifeboat. He also tried via Dochy, to tell me, but like Wills/Lillian, was a doubting Thomas. Then Lights shared with me h/her story...for which I finally believed. Then again, he shared his final moments with me via a couple dreams we shared, for which I saw through his eyes what he saw and heard as he lay dying on the boat deck.

I also believe that God, in His own loving merciful compassionate way, has long since forgiven Will for taking his own life...and that he now is in a special place in heaven.

-MA

edited by MurdochsAid, Jun/12/2006, 12:51 pm


---
R door is always open! Plz do drop by R humble little home...

Will and Ada's Portswood Cottage
Jun/6/2006, 3:48 pm Link to this post Send Email to MurdochsAid   Send PM to MurdochsAid
 
Tippoo Tib Profile
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Re: The shooting re told


Over the years I've run across four different people who claimed to be the reincarnation of Will Murdoch and two others who claimed to be the reincarnation of his wife.

I believe Will and Ada Murdoch were both troubled people who had multiple personalities that they tried to repress. Each of these multiple personalities has now found a way to manifest itself in several different modern-day people, all of whom are very sincere in their beliefs and know for a *fact* that they were once Will and Ada Murdoch. However, each of these personalities formed only a *part* of Will and Ada, and none of these modern-day people can claim to be a reincarnation of the whole, entire person.

edited by Tippoo Tib, Jun/12/2006, 10:02 am
Jun/12/2006, 1:12 am Link to this post Send Email to Tippoo Tib
 
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Re: The shooting re told


quote:

Tippoo Tib wrote:

Over the years I've run across four different people who claimed to be the reincarnation of Will Murdoch and two others who claimed to be the reincarnation of his wife.

I believe Will and Ada Murdoch were both troubled people who had multiple personalities that they tried to repress. Each of these multiple personalities has now found a way to manifest itself in several different modern-day people, all of whom are very sincere in their beliefs and know for a *fact* that they were once Will and Ada Murdoch. However, each of these personalities formed only a *part* of Will and Ada, and none of these modern-day people can claim to be a reincarnation of the whole, entire person.




You may be right on, to a certain extent. But it's actually those whom are claiming to be the reincarnations of these individuals...you really should look out for. Why? Because they, themselves, do a great deal of research on the actual person, so that they can claim that they're that persons' reincarnated selves. Which leads me to believe that a former Mod. on this board, is a fraud.

-MA

edited by MurdochsAid, Jul/4/2006, 3:48 pm


---
R door is always open! Plz do drop by R humble little home...

Will and Ada's Portswood Cottage
Jul/4/2006, 3:43 pm Link to this post Send Email to MurdochsAid   Send PM to MurdochsAid
 


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