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Lights
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
<<It COULD be seen as dabbling in socialism, but honestly my friend, I really don't think Smith would have had such an intention with Morgan. Oh he would have enjoyed his time with Morgan, but I don't think he would venture into that direction. I do not think Smith was that ignorant, although I know you think so!!!!!!!!!! Ha ha.>>
I think with this, common perception may be the key...Smith may not have considered his actions dabbling in socialism, nor would he been likely to want to do so, but in the larger society it would have looked that way. Public opinion drives votes and like it or not, Smith would have had to keep that in mind.
Another thing: Ismay was British and thus a rather handy target.
---
"What I remember about that night- what I will remember as long as I live- is the people crying out to each other as the stern began to plunge down. I heard people crying, 'I love you.'"
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Feb/23/2005, 1:26 am
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Teri Milch
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
True, very true, that public opinion drives votes. I am not an expert on 1912 governmental issues but I am going to guess that Smith was secure in his position if only from a governmental standpoint and his associates backing him. I am not entirely convinced that public opinion in 1912, drove votes the same way they are driven today, when voting, but of course like I said I am not an expert on 1912 governmental voting policies nor am I all that interested.
But I would like to say that although the target should have been Morgan, Ismay was there and ready to pick at. He was sitting ripe for anything. His presence made him a very easy target.
Ismay was also famous for shipping and was tied in to Titanic unlike Morgan. Morgan was just the back-seat owner. Ismay was at the forefront and that is because as I have said many times before, he had shipping in his heart whereas Morgan did not. Bruce was the one who envisioned Titanic, not Morgan, and Bruce was also the one still associated with White Star, that added to the equation why he was drilled so intensely.
Smith's thinking might also have been that Bruce was held accountable because he was still the Managing Director. Right or wrong, his being the Managing Director remains a truth that cannot be refuted.
--Teri
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Feb/25/2005, 1:15 pm
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Lights
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
Dear Teri,
Some excellent points here. I do not know if 1912 politics was a vote-driven as now, but it had to have had at least some effect.
In addition to being Managing Director of WSL, Ismay was British and there was some very noticable anti-British sentiment at the time...add to this Bruce's somewhat shy retiring, aloof demeanor and well, Smith would have I think felt very safe going after him...after all, Ismay was British...why would any proper Yank care? Or even notice?
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"What I remember about that night- what I will remember as long as I live- is the people crying out to each other as the stern began to plunge down. I heard people crying, 'I love you.'"
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Feb/26/2005, 12:46 am
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wills
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
Hmmmm*Wills sets quietly by and watches a good debate*
you both bring up very good points...can't wait to see how this turns out.
Wills 
---
Suicide is a permenant solution to a temporay problem........
Whatever obstacles control,
Go on, true heart,
thou'lt reach the goal.
http://com4.runboard.com/bthetitanicshack
wills~~~~~
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Feb/26/2005, 2:17 am
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Teri Milch
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
Hello Lights,
From Smith’s questioning, I am certain he did not spare anyone anything, and yes, he as a yank did not care what was thought about him, Ismay, or anyone else. He was driven to find out who caused the accident and what could be done about it. That was noble of him of course, but the manner in which he conducted his questioning was ANYTHING but noble. He definitely lacked the British demeanor, but how could a yank display something he was never taught? As crude as anyone might think he was, I am reluctant to state that he cannot be blamed for something he had no instruction in. (Bruce I am sure though, silently scoffed the bloke.)
And because of the magnitude of the event, I am inclined to state Smith did not have voting in mind at all when he “took the stand” drilling the Officers, Managing Director, passengers, and Captain Rostron. He was in it for himself, to attempt to become a hero in finding the culprit of the whole thing. But isn’t that what most questioners do?
Quite possibly there was anti-British-ism present during the Edwardian era, yes, but at the Enquiries, I really think that mindset took a back seat to the curiosity of the cause of the accident AND to the spectacular stage show that was being carried out in front of them.
~~~ A toast to the biggest court-room drama ever displayed in Edwardian history. ~~~
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Feb/27/2005, 1:47 pm
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Lights
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
I do have to agree with you Teri...it has always been a feeling that self-aggandisement was a large part of what was driving Sen. Smith.
I do, however, disagree on his not having an agenda of exploiting anti-British feeling, especially after the disaster. The WSL were ostensibly a British company, all their ships were under British management, thus it was a way of exploiting a natural anti-British feeling because of what would have been considered "British incompetence".
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"What I remember about that night- what I will remember as long as I live- is the people crying out to each other as the stern began to plunge down. I heard people crying, 'I love you.'"
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Mar/3/2005, 7:36 pm
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graham 01
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
Hi
Having read through the debate which has been discussed here I am impressed in the topics opened up.
I think for me the most interesting point in this debate is made by Lights in the closing sentence of the last post.
"thus it was a way of exploiting a natural anti-British feeling because of what would have been considered "British incompetence".
Yes that was in a way the whole reason Smith made so many in a way stupid remarks and questions, Of course if he had managed to show that it was incompetence it has to be remembered that it was a American Co. It could also of course be followed that the following British enquiry was trying to show American Incompetence. The whole reason for the inquiries was indeed in a way to see if incompetence was to be the cause, this would of allowed a flood gate of many law cases.
In all the questions that should of been asked where not, The people who should of been asked to testify where not. The white wash started and ended.
Graham
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Why dont people do what they say nowadays http://www.freewebs.com/hms-kellington/
http://www.freewebs.com/graham7760/index.htm
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Nov/18/2005, 8:11 pm
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Lights
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
Just a quick check in and to say hi, Graham!
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"What I remember about that night- what I will remember as long as I live- is the people crying out to each other as the stern began to plunge down. I heard people crying, 'I love you.'"
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Nov/21/2005, 5:47 pm
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graham 01
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Re: The U.S Senate Enquiry
Hi lights
nice to see you around lights, I trust you are ok.
G
---
Why dont people do what they say nowadays http://www.freewebs.com/hms-kellington/
http://www.freewebs.com/graham7760/index.htm
http://www.freewebs.com/hmsroyaloak/
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Nov/21/2005, 6:00 pm
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